Passion, Opportunity, Pivot with Jess Hainsworth

Bagel: [00:00:00] What would you do if you sat at an airport bar and someone offered you a dream job, but it was miles away from your family and friends? What would it take for you to move to a new city and start a new life? Have you ever been given an opportunity that you almost turned down that ended up being a beacon of light on a new path?

Well, in this episode, you're going to meet someone who is faced with all of these scenarios. And her name is Jess. What I loved about this conversation is that Jess doesn't sugar coat anything. She definitely shared the highs and lows, even after the fact, of saying yes to some of her experiences. But the moral of the story is that she kept pursuing what she felt she wanted in those moments.

I'm excited for you to hear this interview with Jess Hainsworth, owner of Honest Thrift Studio and Garden Coffee in San Diego, California. As she walks us through her journey from packing two bags to travel and live abroad to starting not one but two people focused businesses in her new home of Southern California.

Here it is, episode 15 with Jess Hainsworth.

Welcome to the Live Your Values podcast. I'm your host Mike Bagel. And today I am beyond excited to welcome our guests for today's episode- Jess Hainsworth, owner of Honest Thrift Studio and Garden Coffee in San Diego, California. And I just want to say  an specially big welcome Jess. You're, I think, you're the first interview I've had where we actually have not known each other prior. We've sort of connected through a friend, our friend, Danielle, who was on the podcast. And so you're sort of a first on this podcast. So welcome.

Jess: [00:01:45] Thank you. Oh, thank you for trusting me.

Bagel: [00:01:47] Okay, you gotta, you kinda just have to trust a lot when you're, when you're doing this kind of thing. Right. And I think if I was just interviewing my friends for, you know, 50 episodes, I think eventually people would kind of get like, okay, this is just this guy's inner circle. So I love that we can branch out. And I love that we have this shared connection.  For our listeners, so Danielle appeared on an episode prior, and I don't know if you guys are that close. But just how did, how did you two meet and what's the connection there?

Jess: [00:02:16] Yes. So I have Honest Thrift Studio. I've had that store for a little over three years and it's half thrift shop, half plant shop, but more over a friendship shop. And so I had a girl walk in probably a year and a half ago, and we just felt very fast in friendship love. And she made the mistake of gifting me a handmade headband and a handmade dog bandana for my dog that matched.

And so after that, I was like, I'm never letting you go. Her name is headband Sam she's the best. And she and Danielle connected. And so had man Sam brought Danielle into the store and I was like, well, any friend of headband Sam's, but willingly chose to walk into the shop is also a friend of mine.

Bagel: [00:03:06] Yeah, that's funny. I feel like I've, I've heard this headband Sam. This is ringing a bell now.

Jess: [00:03:12] Listen, she makes, she makes things for guys as well. Yeah.

Bagel: [00:03:16] I have a feeling there be a lot of things we're going to be checking out after this episode . I was really excited to be able to bring you on the show and to talk to you a little bit about your different businesses.

And we're definitely going to dive into that more. I was going to say, give us your life story, but you know, maybe not the whole thing. But like maybe just like a, how did you get to where you are now in running these businesses? Maybe kind of catch us up on  how you've gotten to that point.

Jess: [00:03:39] Yeah, definitely.  I was in nine different schools before ninth grade. We moved internationally a lot and so I was often a new kid. And so that was something that I had to lean into. And so to kind of skip around that has really helped me in my life to welcome the new kids. Be it just like the Danielle in the store. Because as adults, we're still often the new kids. So I went to high school and college in Florida, and then I took my first job in a corporate sales position and learned so much. And was almost miserable. And so I wanted to leave that job. So I found what I thought was a really great job in Germany doing a similar role. Turns out it was just the same job in Germany. 

Bagel: [00:04:39] Oh wow. 

Jess: [00:04:41] Yeah. Which, you know, I also learned a lot from that. But it was a contract position. And so at the end it was not something that I felt was a life decision for me that I wanted to continue to pursue. And I, at this point I'd already met who is my now husband. He actually moved to Germany with me and so we had already downsized to about four-ish suitcases. So at the end of the contract, we were like, let's just go to two backpacks. 

Bagel: [00:05:10] Oh man. 

Jess: [00:05:12] Yeah. So, and we traveled  for a year. We did six months in Europe and six months in Asia. And at the end of that year, we decided to come back to San Diego. I had never visited California before.

Bagel: [00:05:25] Yeah. Interesting.

Jess: [00:05:26] Yeah, thank goodness. He picked San Diego. Cause I kind of opened it up since he moved to Germany with me of like, we can live anywhere in the world. Cause, and you know, you moved to Germany for me. Where do you want to live? And in hindsight I'm like, God, you could've picked some were cold.

Bagel: [00:05:42] It's true. Yeah.

Jess: [00:05:45] So we moved to San Diego. I kind of took a break. When we moved, I didn't work for a couple months. And during that time, I really tried to think of what I wanted in a, in a job. And not necessarily in a job, in a career and a lifestyle. So I threw my resume back up on the internet and. Went through a couple of job interviews. There was this one company that just, I still think of them. So fondly, it was, predominantly females. It, the company culture was incredible. And I went there, I think around five pretty intensive interviews. And I was sitting in my car when they called me to extend the offer. And I remember I hung up the phone and I cried because I was like, I don't want to do that.

Bagel: [00:06:42] Wow.

Jess: [00:06:45] Yeah. And I have goosebumps just now, just because I don't think about that moment very often. But it was a very aha moment for me on which I'm very grateful for, because I think life's aha moments aren't that clear usually. You kinda gotta dig for So I declined the offer and I started looking for a space to rent for Honest Thrift. And at that point in time, it was just, it's just honest, thrift. I was painting furniture out of our second bedroom and selling it on any type of online platform I could. And saving all that money, which is then what I used to put towards signing the lease. And a couple of months in to honest thrift, I was like, Oh man, I originally I was in one location, which I've now since moved from that kept. The store in the first location was massive. And I was like, I got, I've got to bring people into this space. So I started hosting craft nights, plant parties. And it just kept growing. And that is when I decided to add the word studio to the end of my business. Not so much in a crafty sense, but in a, I can now do whatever I want sense. 

Bagel: [00:07:42] Yeah, I like it. 

Jess: [00:07:50] Yeah. And so, so yeah, so that's what led me to Honest Thrift Studio, which just is truly as cheesy as it can sound is a dream come true business. I've just always wanted my own thrift store. So yeah.

Bagel: [00:07:59] Yeah, that's awesome. I'm going to try to keep it to things that might relate to values and things that matter in kind of some of the choices you made. And I think that that was the thing that stood out to me a lot in what you just shared. And thank you for giving us the condensed history there.

I was just curious about that move to Germany, and then the decision to travel. And  you're already at four suitcases, why not just go to two backpacks? Like just walk us through that a little bit. What enticed you at that point in your life?

Just say, I'm going to go travel. That's what matters to me right now. This is what I want.

Jess: [00:08:31] Yeah, I think I have to back up a little bit more because the way I ended up in Germany feeds into the bigger answer. I was going on a family vacation, which is the only reason I was able to go on this vacation right out of college because my family was going and they so kindly paid for it. so we were meeting at JFK airport.

Remember those things, amazing, airport bars. Um, so my parents and sister weren't there yet. And we were actually flying over to Germany for a family vacation. And so I was at the airport bar. Spending way too much on a bloody Mary waiting for my parents to arrive and the bartender, you know, made casual conversation of like, where are you going?

And I said, Frankfurt, and the lady next to me, or maybe she is more like three or four seats down, but there wasn't anybody between us. Was like, Oh, did you know that we're delayed six hours? And I was like, no, I didn't know. And so, but,

Bagel: [00:09:36] Welcome to JFK.

Jess: [00:09:37] Oh my gosh, thank goodness we had good seats at the bar. So we ended up, you know, talking for a long time. And she is the one who ended up being my boss in Germany. Yeah.

Bagel: [00:09:50] That's crazy.

Jess: [00:09:51] Yeah. So after six ish hours, you know, she asked what I did. I asked her what she did and I just boldly said, ask her, how do I get your job? And she was like, we're hiring. And so it just went from there. And then once we were in Germany and I was doing the job and Mark was with me, I just knew I wanted to travel.

I think, you know, growing up moving so much, I got really lucky that I was exposed to a lot of different cultures. But I also was even luckier to know that like I wasn't done. Just because I'd seen it once didn't mean it was checked off my bucket list and I never wanted to go back. So yeah.

Bagel: [00:10:32] Yeah, that's really interesting. I think the, that idea, that last thing you just mentioned is a really interesting one. Because I think there are so many different types of travelers and not to derail us too far in that direction, but it's just something I know, probably a lot of people listening to podcasts might be travelers themselves or interested in doing more of that. And so there's difference between just checking something off the list versus like, Actually saying like, no, there's more to explore here, I think it's good to know  who you are in that sense of traveler. Really cool.

Jess: [00:11:05] And I think it also, it ties into the pace that I try to live my life, even when I'm not traveling. Since we were fortunate enough to be able to travel for so long. We were able to spend at least two weeks in each spot. Which also allowed us to stretch our budget, which is a big, old circle reason of why we were able to travel so long is because we could stay in each place for such a long period of time. So even now I try to, you know, we're not traveling, especially we're not traveling now. So I, yeah, I try to really savor what we have. Be it just like the patio restaurant, or like the noon. We got a Pogo stick during COVID. 

Bagel: [00:11:50] I didn't know they still made those.

Jess: [00:11:52] Well, I don't know if they should. They're quite dangerous, but I would find,

Bagel: [00:11:57] But then liability forms come with it, right.

Jess: [00:11:58] Yes. Oh my gosh. I tried to be intentional because you know, you get a lot of new toys and for the first 24-48 hours, they're very exciting. And then they just live in your garage. So I tried to make sure, you know, we really milked as much  joy from it as we could. And now my sister's here visiting.  And she goes, the one thing I want to do before I leave is Pogo.

Bagel: [00:12:20] That's really funny. So apparently, I mean, maybe, maybe it's going to be a novelty thing for a lot of people, but it is, that's. Yeah. If you showed me a Pogo stick, I'd be interested. I think a lot of people would.

Jess: [00:12:33] Yeah. It's yeah, there you can't not smile.

Bagel: [00:12:38] Right, right. Cause it's like, there's something about that just feels like childhood. 

So you kind of talked about this, like, okay, you could've, you could've wound up in a lot of places and your husband kind of guided you towards San Diego and you said you had not been there before. So what were your thoughts before? And then once you got there, like, were you excited? Were you nervous? Like walk us through what that was like.

Jess: [00:13:00] Yeah, I was so excited. Because in a sense it would still be traveling. Yeah, we'd never been, we were also still in the first year of our relationship, so everything was new.  So that's

Bagel: [00:13:12] A pretty big move for that early.

Jess: [00:13:14] We moved at lightning speeds. We actually eloped while we were traveling.

Bagel: [00:13:19] Wow, awesome. That's really cool.

Jess: [00:13:21] Yes. And it worked out well, thank God.

Bagel: [00:13:24] I was going to say, yeah. 

Jess: [00:13:25] Yeah, so I was really excited. And Then I think maybe a couple weeks after we had decided for sure we were moving to San Diego, I was like, "So Mark talked to me, like, tell me about San Diego. Why did you pick it? Why are you excited to go there?" Almost like the question you just prompted me with. And he was like, "Oh Jess, they have these acai bowls." And I was like, what? And he explained it to me. And in my mind, I thought, "We are moving for yogurt?!"

Bagel: [00:13:53] I was just thinking the same thing.

Jess: [00:13:55] Oh,

Bagel: [00:13:55] I mean, I love me some yogurt, but yeah.

Jess: [00:13:58] I couldn't believe I really, I was shocked. But I can say now, after living here for like four years, it's worth it. We always have it in our freezer. It is really, really good. and 

Bagel: [00:14:09] So he really did move there for the acia bowls.

Jess: [00:14:12] And the weather and the beach. So 

Bagel: [00:14:15] Some other things thrown in there.

Jess: [00:14:15] Some other things, but they just weren't at the front of his mind when I would ask him these questions. So I, I did think we were moving just for yogurt. And I also know it isn't yogurt now. I didn't know. I didn't know that. I know that now.

Bagel: [00:14:31] I was just going to say, I, I feel like I've had one, but is it, what is the base of it? Is it actually just the fruit?

Jess: [00:14:37] Yeah, the fruit of acia, but most people buy it online and it's in pouches and it's kind of icy. But the trick is you need to buy it in sorbet form and it is heaven on a spoon. It makes every smoothie amazing. It's it's really good.

Bagel: [00:14:56] Yeah. And now I'm like, I kind of need to get one, but can't you get them anywhere? I don't want to harp on this, but like, aren't they everywhere now?

Jess: [00:15:04] I don't know. We can't ever leave San Diego.

Bagel: [00:15:06] Yeah, that's a good point. 

Jess: [00:15:08] They have this beach, I prefer ocean beach dog beach, but there's a couple.  That it's an off-leash dog beach and I think. I don't know if Mark mentioned it to me before we moved, but I would move just for that, all over again. Yeah. Our dog is a swimmer. We were both swimmers, not like competitively or athletically. I just like to be submerged in water, preferably floating in water with a drink. But yeah, so I ended up, thankfully I ended up really liking San Diego.

Bagel: [00:15:39] Yeah,  I have family in LA, so I've been to Southern California a bunch. But only San Diego like I said that one time, but the vibe was pretty, pretty evident as soon as you get there. And I'm sure, you know, not to stereotype, I know there's different parts of town in different areas and stuff. But just very much more relaxed pace of life, than let's say the Northeast was. And I think I got a little bit of that as well in North Carolina now that I'm here, especially when I was on the coast as well. But obviously a very specific type of culture there.  Did that fit you right away? Was there an  adjusting to that? Like how was, how was the culture like moving to that new place? Especially since I know you said you've kind of traveled a lot and jumped around to different places growing up. Did that make it easier to adjust?

Jess: [00:16:23] I think so. Southern California is very easy. I'd say that is such a good word. Just easy. So it was easy, to come back, there was a bit of culture shock and I would honestly say a little bit of morning from the travel. We tried to watch, who is that travel food chef. I can't remember his name, but a couple of weeks after we landed and I just saw those, "I just want to be back." And I think there is still that longing, but at the same time in that moment I didn't have Honest Thrift studio or Garden Coffee. So we've definitely put down roots, which makes it easier to stay. And so, and yes, there was a bit of a transition. It wasn't too difficult though, because it San Diego, but there were some adjustments.

Bagel: [00:17:16] I want to point out that even moving to a place that most consider a sunny paradise, doesn't come without hesitation, challenges, and even "mourning", as Jess put it. When you're used to a certain lifestyle and you up and plant yourself in a completely new environment, there's always going to be a transition. And time is needed to grow those roots.

Have you ever uprooted your own life, literally or figuratively? What was it like at first? How long did it take you to adjust? Was it worth it?  

Yeah, for sure. Yeah. It sounds like it could have, it could have certainly been more challenging. But there's always, I assume there's always an adjustment, no matter where they move. Even if it, it feels like a heavenly place. Like I know a lot of people describe San Diego as. So. So you, you started to share a little bit about your businesses.

Why don't we jump back to that?  You told us sort of how you started Honest Thrift and, and then sort of how it evolved into the studio. Tell us a little bit more about why that was a passion. You know, how did that come about and what made you, what helped you make that decision to open the business in the first place?

Because that's a pretty big deal.

Jess: [00:18:27] Yes. Well, I, since we moved so much, we did a lot of thrifting. You know, because we didn't move every single thing every single time. And it was really fun. I have a sister. So she and I. My mom took us. My dad supported us, but he didn't really, he didn't usually go. And all three of us and still to this day, we all three love it.

And so I always wanted my own because you know, sometimes there's a stigma attached with secondhand items. Or even just the buildings that house those stores. That they stink or it's not clean or you know, you're not fancy. And I just remember, you know, the things we would get. We would come home and be through the roof about having them.

And I was like, everybody needs to know how good this could be. And so I really wanted to have my own store so that I could do that. I could make it a really nice place where people would go in and feel, you know, just amazing and be surrounded by beauty. And, you know, there's nothing wrong with boutique stores. But it's very easy to go in and want everything and not be able to afford anything. 

Um, yeah. Or even be able to afford some of the things and get home and still have buyer's remorse because, you know, there was probably a less expensive option. And so that was my aim, before I ever opened the door was that someone could come in and they would just feel enveloped by the beauty and the experience, but they could also spend 20 ish dollars, leave with multiple items, and never ever think about their wallet and have any bit of buyers' remorse.

It's just. Shopping can be such a guilty pleasure, but we could make it so much less guilty if we did it in a more ethical way.

Bagel: [00:20:24] Hmm. Yeah.

Jess: [00:20:27] Yeah.

Bagel: [00:20:28] That's powerful. I'm starting to get chills here a little bit. That's like, Oh man, I guess that's so. I feel like that speaks to, I would imagine, to a lot of millennials and probably even younger generations maybe. And maybe older generations too. But I think especially kind of where we're at right now in the world.

Like there's a lot of stuff. There's a lot of materials and I think we're. All these generations coming up now, or like going to be a lot more conscious of waste. And, you know, making sure things are sustainable and being able to reuse stuff and not like using more than we need. Right. And so I imagine it sounds like that that's sort of built in to what you're trying to share and a little bit of your vision. But it does sound like you have this really clear vision of like making, you know, the thrift store experience more accessible and exciting and enticing. I don't want to put words in your mouth, but I'm kind of getting the sense that like you care a lot about the experience that people are having when they're walking into one of these stores.

Jess: [00:21:28] Yeah. Well, because at the end of the day, it's a used spatula. It's not glamorous on its own. You've got to, you gotta do all the other things with it. You you've got to clean the floors. You've got to put it pretty on the bookshelf by some other pretty used items that standing alone wouldn't be anything that special. And I really enjoy that. I love bringing order to a space. So I do have a creative brain, but I I'm not handy or artsy. But the store is a canvas for me that every single week, cause I'm open Wednesday through Saturday. Sunday, I rest the entire day and Mondays and Tuesdays I restock and restage.

So every week it's new. And it's just, it truly is a canvas that's ready to be created in any way. So the furniture can be moved. We have this, netting, wire netting. It looks like chicken wire, but someone told me it's not chicken wire, but for the sake of this, we can call it chicken wire. But we can hang, we have these beautiful wooden beams and you can hang everything from the ceiling. So we have a ceiling of plants, but we also through random treasures up there To mix in with the plants. And it's just everywhere you look. Cause it's a very tiny space. It's about 300 square feet. It's not large. And it's when I had the first store. I can't remember the square footage, but I want to say it was around 1600 square feet. 

Bagel: [00:22:57] Big difference. Okay. 

Jess: [00:22:59] Huge. And so when I moved locations, I was a little, a little nervous about the size. Which actually turned out to be a huge benefit. One  it's a lot less for me to manage. I can keep my eyes on everyone. I can make it look pretty. I can drink a diet Coke and commit to an hour and make it look good. And the other store, like it took all day to redo it. And then also it allows the inventory to turn over much quicker because people see everything easier. Items would sit in the other store for weeks on end and someone would come in who had been in the week prior. And they were like, I've always been looking for this. And in my mind, I was like, it was here last week when you were here. But in the tiny space, it's harder for them to miss. And then the third and the best reason that the tinier space is better. Is people have to meet each other. and that's been the very best thing. And I think it allowed my business to grow in ways that it never could have in 1600 square feet. So I'm really thankful that it's only 300 square feet.

Bagel: [00:24:04] Yeah, that's amazing. So we need to break this down just a little bit. Because like the business counselor in me is definitely like, I'm having to tame it over here. And I'm like, no, let's focus on just getting to know your story, but I'm so, it's so interesting. It's so intriguing to hear like, there's so many aspects of that, like having the more confined space, right?

So it's sort of necessity, breeds invention. You're having to figure out ways that you can still run this business effectively and efficiently. And you're just doing it in a smaller space. And so you're just, you're finding ways to adapt. Right. So I think that's awesome. The fact that there's this like added benefit of, you know, people interacting is really cool. And probably, you know, whether it was intentional or not, it's sort of this by-product of having people engage with each other a little bit more and maybe even having some more interaction with staff and yourself. I'm sure that that's really nice too. and then inventory thing. Yeah. I could see that again from a business standpoint of just like things are turning over more quickly. So people, it creates a little urgency. People are like, Oh wait, like if I don't get this, now it's going to be gone. So all of that is so, so cool.

What are the aspects of the job  and in this business that like excite you the most? I'm just so interested to know, like, what gets you up every day? I was like, what are you most excited about? And does that change day to day?

Jess: [00:25:23] Ooh, that's... That is a great question. Because I do wake up excited to go to the store every day. But I, if I have to narrow it down, that makes it a little more hard.

Bagel: [00:25:33] We could you top three. We don't have to do one thing. Could be, it could be multiple.

Jess: [00:25:38] I really like the plants a lot. In the beginning I brought them in from my house. So the volume wasn't as high because it was only what I was able to propagate. But also they weren't selling as fast because their business was newer. And now that, we're in year three, you know, we have a very solid, loyal customer base. Which is, I'm forever grateful for.  So the plants are able to sell faster, which means I'm able to buy more and selling them is so fun because it's a living thing. So the communication or the conversation that happens over selling a plant is much different over than selling a spatula. Yeah. And plant people are the best people, you know, because they see this item or they see this plant and they want it to live. 

Bagel: [00:26:27] Hmm. 

Jess: [00:26:28] Which just makes them the best. And then it's also fun because plants are plants and you can't control them. So it's fun to see people, you know, say like, "Oh, I bought this plant and it was like, it was this size and it, you know, it was only two inches tall and three inches wide. And now it's outgrow the space. I don't know what to do."

And I'm like, you can't do anything. That's nature. It gets happening. So you either got to go with it or get the plan out to someone else, but you can't make it stay tiny.

Bagel: [00:26:57] And so I was watching, one of your IGTV videos, and you were explaining so well about how a plant is moving. Like the stress that we go through and this hit me, this resonated with me so well, because we are in the middle of moving right now. And so the stress that's coming along with that, and even the little things and just having to repeat every day of just like constant back and forth. Right.

And so the analogy you drew to that with plants, like taking them out of their home and putting them in a new home and then immediately trying to water them and just being like plants like, Whoa. Too many things at once here. Like that clicked with me. And that was like, yeah, it's a living thing. Like, you know, of course, like it needs time to adjust.

So I just wanted to say, I love the way that you're making things easy to understand and relate to, and really digestible for the audience, at least on social media. So I imagine you do the same in the store too.

Jess: [00:27:50] Thank you. Thank you so much. Thrift shops can be perceived a certain way. Not all plant shops, but a good majority can be seen as fancy and you need to have prior knowledge in order to go in there and buy one of their plants. Which to me is silly. How do you ever start knowing anything about them unless you get one, like your first one? So I try to be, I try to source really tough plants. I'm not a rare plant shop. I'm not a fancy plant shop. I'm not the most expensive plant shop.

I'm actually trying to do the opposite, and bring in, you know, plants that are going to be tough, and, and easy to learn with.

Bagel: [00:28:35] Yeah. That makes sense too. I think so when people are in this type of store, maybe that's not their first thought. But when they see something that is easy enough for them to learn about and to pick up and maybe to have a conversation about, to feel good about taking home, that seems like it fits more of the business model. And maybe also maybe fits a little bit of the audience that's coming into your store. I would imagine.

Jess: [00:28:58] Yeah. Yeah. I just want everything to be accessible. I don't want anyone to feel like they don't belong or they don't know what they're supposed to do or they can't ask a question. I just think there's enough places that are really fancy. And I just don't, I don't want to be fancy.

Bagel: [00:29:17] I'm impressed with the way Jess is able to communicate the values of her business and stay true to them. She knew she wanted to create a community around plants and everyday items that felt accessible and not too fancy. It's clear that these values guide her decision-making and culture in her shop, as well as on social. 

What do you stand for in your work? In what ways are you contributing to the culture of your environment?

Well, I think that's a great segue to talk about values. Because you just talked about accessibility and obviously that's something that's important to you. But as you know, this is the Live Your Values podcast. And so you knew this question was going to come. So I'm so curious  if you wanted to share your personal values and, or your business values and how they intersect or overlap in any way.

Jess: [00:30:09] Yeah, people. I think, I think that's personal and business. Honest Thrift Studio, it's a very personal business. As you, if you just take a peek at the Instagram stories or the highlights, there's no staging. Which I really like, but you have people over everything else, even over profits. Because at the end of the day, if I'm making a ton of money but nobody's happy there, to me it isn't a success. And I knew going, setting out for a thrift store that wasn't going to be a billion dollar venture. Which I loved, it made it all the more easier to focus on those intangibles, the experience of it. And we haven't talked about Garden Coffee much, but it's really helped cause I almost fell into owning Garden Coffee.

So this has been a, quite a learning curve. It's been very fun. But I, you know, Honest Thrift Studio is just, I just wanted to do it from the minute I knew I could do something like that. And Garden Coffee has been different. So knowing that I have people at the front of it has made every decision easier.

For example, we're expanding into food. And there are a lot of really wonderful chefs that are ready to be hired and bring all their knowledge. But I'm having a difficult time selecting one because I want to make sure that our price point aligns with Honest Thrift studio because we share a patio. It's just, it's the same group of people frequenting both businesses. So even though I have the opportunity to serve five star lunches,

Bagel: [00:31:51] Yeah.

Jess: [00:31:52] I don't, I don't want two people, two friends to come, one be on a serious budget. And one having a treat herself day and that one for a person feel left out. So,  if I didn't have Honest Thrift Studio from the beginning to learn that this was so important to me and I had just opened Garden Coffee, I think I'd be like, yes, get that fancy cheese. Like let's make the most we can. so it's, it's been challenging, but in really good ways .

Bagel: [00:32:22] Yeah, it's such a cool lesson to learn.  Sometimes those, the first, sometimes second, sometimes even third business that you tried to open in the past was just prepping you for this one that's actually going to work out. Right. And obviously it doesn't sound like that's the case with you. It sounds like Honest Thrift is doing well. And that's kind of where your passion is lying, which is really cool. No matter what, like you're only going to move forward, right? You're only going to learn more by going through the challenges of running a business and learning more about what matters to you. Which I think obviously in the context and the framework of this podcast, I think is what we're really trying to hammer home. 

So,  how did you kind of find yourself taking on that coffee business? Because I'm curious, cause I'm a huge coffee fan. So I really, really, I just want to know why you decided to open a coffee business. 

Jess: [00:33:12] Yes. Especially seeing as I don't really drink coffee.

Bagel: [00:33:15] Uh huh. Okay. Yeah, that is very, even more interesting now.

Jess: [00:33:19] Yes. But to circle back, Honest Thrift studio is my first business and thank goodness it is doing really well. But within it, I have tried a lot of different things that didn't work well. So I feel what you're saying that it might, when you tell people it might be the second, third or fourth business that really takes off, you know, I've tried to add branches to honest their studio that did not work. And I try, and some of them I've tried really hard. Like not just a one, one try and toss it in the bucket. Like multiple months. But all I'm really thankful for every single thing that I did try, cause it led it to what the business is today. 

 So to answer your coffee question. So Honest Thrift studio is nestled in a complex with eight other businesses. And it's a pretty tiny complex, there are five storefronts on the front. And then in the back, there's Honest Thrift studio and Garden Coffee, and a shared patio between all the businesses.

Bagel: [00:34:22] By the way, I just want to let our listeners know that Jess is drawing this out with her hands and it is so helpful for someone like me who is visual. Like you were literally like pointing to where things were and then you did the behind thing. I know no one's going to see this, but I love that. That was great.

Jess: [00:34:39] I have given these directions many a times.

Bagel: [00:34:42] Sorry to cut you off.

Jess: [00:34:43] No, no, it's fine. So the bulk of the patio lies in Garden Coffee, and the front of Honest Thrift studio and Garden Coffee is actually 100% outdoor venue. Our kitchen is inside. And where are we prepared the coffee, but all seating is outdoors. Which a year ago, when I signed the lease, I was like, God, I kind of wish I had some indoor seating and now I am so dang thankful for what that space is.

Bagel: [00:35:11] I was going to say.

Jess: [00:35:13] So yeah, so I've had this store, at this location it's called Old Town Local for a little over a year. My first location, I ended up moving because my landlord just things went awry to put it in a nice soundbite. Yes. And so I came to my Old Town Local and have God sent angels for landlords. They are incredible. I've been with them now for two and a half years and they just keep being the absolute best, even, especially in the midst of COVID. When a landlord could truly make or break a business. They have done nothing but elevate, as a small business owner. So I'm really, really hope they listen to this. But so they, they approached me about a year and a half ago. It was already a coffee shop and it had gone through two owners and for just many reasons, it didn't work out. So before they came to me, they approached me in Honest Thrift. They're like, you know, before we open it up to other people, would you be interested?

And I laughed. I was like, Oh my gosh, thank you so much. So nice of you to offer me, but probably not. you know, I did tell them, you know, I know it's not a good business move to say no, or yes right now. So I will think about it.

Bagel: [00:36:40] Okay. There's some maturity there. A little, little bit of wisdom coming out.

Jess: [00:36:44] Yeah. I remember being like, but probably not, but. And it's a husband and wife duo, and they stayed and then they hung out for a little while. And they just were the best. And I, Mark my husband is a tax accountant, and this is in the middle of tax season. And so I knew he was going to be working late. But, you know, by the end of the day, I was just buzzing with this information. And so I pull the smooth line and I say, Hey, can I drop some beers by the office for you and the guys?

Bagel: [00:37:19] Oh, slick move. Very slick move.

Jess: [00:37:23] I know, I know. And he's pretty, we are definitely opposites. So whereas I am quick to like laugh in the face of my landlord lovingly and then bounce around with some champagne afterwards with them. He's much more on the tame side. And he's a tax accountant, if that tells you anything too. So I brought up the beer, I like closed his office door and was like, so, and I dropped it on him. And he looked at me so calm. He was like, I was just thinking last week, how cool it would be if you had that space.

Bagel: [00:37:56] Woa, okay.

Jess: [00:37:58] Yes. Yeah, it was, I really felt like it was another one of those aha moments where anything that I had doubted that "probably not" turned into a "yes" in that office. And so it took a year and a half and it, quite, that's not correct, it took a little over a year to get it open. There are a ton of hurdles. I actually started with three partners, and we all thought it was going to take about six to eight weeks. And over the course of a year, it ended up that they all decided individually and at different times to step away. Yeah, so, but it was one of those things that I still felt that it was too good of an opportunity.

And I'm sure this ties into value somehow, but I just couldn't handle the thought of giving up and seeing someone walk into Honest Thrift Studio with a coffee cup that had a logo on it that wasn't my business.  So I kept going, the last, the last little bit, especially once COVID happened was very hard. Probably the hardest thing I've ever done. And I was doing it alone, which was really hard. And I, it was a hard year and I remember thinking like, "Is this even supposed to be my coffee shop?"  And after about a month of it being open, I was like, I'm going to say the F word, but I'm not going  like it was. It is the coolest space in the whole world.  I didn't realize how many people went to coffee shops .

Bagel: [00:39:42] It’s a big thing.

Jess: [00:39:43] Oh my God. And it's it is  completely different from Honest Thrift Studio and exactly the same at the same time. So it just the shop, Honest Thrift Studio is so tiny. It's really hard when it gets, you know, with like 10 people in there to all hang out. So now it's really cool to be like, Oh my gosh, you and you will like each other so much. Go get a coffee. And then they have that space to go over to. So it's, I'm so happy that that year is gone. And that it worked out to be able to open it because it is so cool.

Bagel: [00:40:22] That's awesome. I mean, again, getting some chills here. So just take me back really quick and to take our listeners back because. It sounds like, that was a really stressful year from what I'm gauging. I mean, it was probably pretty tumultuous, lots of ups and downs. The fact that you had three partners, they all sort of bowed out one at a time. What really drove you, whether it's related to values or something else? Like what drove you to actually say yes? It sounds like there was a conversation with your husband about it, but what drove you to say yes.  And what kept you hanging on until that first month where it finally felt, it sounds like it felt like it was worthwhile.

Jess: [00:41:01] Yeah. I think initially when I said yes to Garden Coffee, I put all these boundaries up saying, you know, I need to still be dedicated to Honest Thrift Studio. I can't let the work of Garden Coffee hinder these three years that I've poured into Honest Thrift Studio. And then it almost switched as it ended up being by myself.

You know, it was almost like I can't let someone else open this coffee shop because Honest Thrift Studio needs that space for the connections to continue once the shopping ends. So what started as almost like a me pushing, ended up what pulls me through to keep going.

Bagel: [00:41:52] Yeah. It sounds like it all relates back to that first value you mentioned, which is the people, right? Like facilitating those connections and also providing a space for people to engage and to connect and to interact. So it's funny to hear you say, like, you're not even really a coffee drinker. But like yet the coffee shop ends up being sort of the breeding ground to help people like get to know each other and maybe interacts with your business and like the environment and the culture that you're trying to create.

Jess: [00:42:23] 100%. And I think we hit the jackpot opening during COVID, which had you told me that a year ago..

Bagel: [00:42:32] Yeah. A lot of those stories right now, but that's, that's really cool.

Jess: [00:42:37] You know, we are a completely outdoor venue, so we're one of the few businesses that's able to stay open at full capacity. We also weren't open before COVID so nobody is walking in there with prior expectations. So nobody's disappointed. And I think had we been able to open before COVID and used fancy ceramic mugs and throw pillows, all things that we would have been taking away once we re-opened people would have known. But people don't know because we weren't open. And so I, and people were in their homes for three months and now we're finally able to safely go out. But there's so few places you can safely go out to. And Garden Coffee is one of them. And Honest Thrift Studio is too, I've limited it to only three people in the store at a time. I cleared out half the furniture so that it's, the aisles are huge and it really could accommodate probably five people with six feet of distance.

But for me, that people are over the profit and I'd much rather people feel safe and still have that experience of going in there and be like, "I love it here." Not, "Is someone behind me? Do I need to shift?" Are they, like, so limiting it to three people has allowed for that experience to continue even in the midst of a global pandemic. Which, Oh my gosh, I didn't see any of this coming.

If you would have told me that when it is the most difficult to own my businesses, would be when my businesses do the best. I'd be like, you need to go back to school. That's not how things work. That's you're wrong. But yeah it's, I don't know how things are in North Carolina, but I would imagine they're somewhat similar.

Tensions are high, public spaces are just tough to be in. And I forget that because at Honest Thrift and Garden Coffee, the tensions aren't high. The respect is there. but it's almost like a weight is lifted. And I don't remember until I try to go out to other places .

Bagel: [00:44:50] For sure.  It's crazy, you know, there's such a range of how people are approaching and treating what's going on with the pandemic. And obviously, you know, we've had a lot of episodes where this comes up and we kind of talk through it. But what I, what resonated with me a lot of what you just said. And what I think is so important is that you are showing some leadership. You're putting out there and for your customers, for anyone who interacts with you. Whether it's suppliers, customers, just people walking by, you're showing them that it's important to you. That you respect their health and safety. And that you're also just creating probably an inclusive place for people who do still want to go out on their Saturday and shop. That they do have a place to do that as long as they're doing it safely. And so  it starts with the owner. It starts with the person running the business and kind of trickles down or trickles out to the people who are kind of coming in and seeing it.

And I just think that that's so important. And a great lesson for not just business owners, but so many people to hear what, whether they're like a leader in an organization or whatever. Maybe it's just they're the head of their household at home. Right. Like setting an example for what, for what that little environment can look like, I think is just so, so important.

Jess: [00:46:07] Thank you. That's very kind. I appreciate that.

Bagel: [00:46:10] How are you setting an example in the groups that you lead? Whether it's your family, your coworkers, or just a side hobby, it's likely the case that others rely on you at times for direction. What is your philosophy on leading others? Take some time to write it out.

Yeah, of course. I'm curious. You've talked a lot about being, people focused and that sort of thing. I'm curious. What sort of feedback have you gotten from the people who are your customers, people who engage with you online? Like what are you hearing? And I'm sure you're going to be humble about it, but I'm just curious. Like what do you hear from people that excites you? Have you heard any, anything bad that you've had to like fix in your business? Like whatever you're willing to share? 

Jess: [00:46:58] Well, I know without a doubt, it's not everyone's cup of tea. But those people don't come back. So, it's people who come back. I try to greet almost everyone that comes in the door, by saying "Hi friend." 

Bagel: [00:47:13] I like that.

Jess: [00:47:14] Oh, it's the best. And the very best is when people start saying it back. And so that is something really cool that I love hearing. And then I also hear it like in Garden Coffee in passing, of other shoppers who met in the store greeting each other that way. 

Bagel: [00:47:34] That's so cool.

Jess: [00:47:35] Yeah, and just hearing other people call it a friendship shop or their happy place. And you know, and some Saturdays, we have people wait in line for Honest Thrift Studio for over an hour. We're still selling spatulas, didn't change the stuff.

So it's just, it's just, people are special. Even when people are tests they're special. And those people actually are the ones who need a space. A safe, a really safe space. They're probably not feeling love in many other spaces. So it's really cool to see other shoppers be the ones that can give that love. Yeah, it's really, it's really neat. And, and again, it's a thrift store. But I put some stuff on Instagram and at least once a week, minimum, someone will come in and be like, Oh, is that. We'll just keep using spatula. Cause it's a great example and it's silly and it's a good word. Like spatula still here and a shopper will already have it in her hand and she'll go, Oh, you can have it.

Bagel: [00:48:51] Wow.

Jess: [00:48:52] It blows my mind.

Bagel: [00:48:56] Culture of giving. 

Jess: [00:48:59] Yep. It's incredible. Or even plants, you know? Cause there's only so many. And you know, someone will come in looking for a certain one and as someone has the last one, she was like, Oh, you can have it.

Bagel: [00:49:06] That's really, that's like the word sweet comes to mind. It seems like really sweet. And do you have other, I didn't ask you this, but do you have other staff that work there as well? Or is it just you.

Jess: [00:49:17] Yes. So Honest Thrift Studio for the first two and a half more, almost three years was just me. But I had all the help in the world from any friends and family who were willing to just help for even 10 minutes. I have some friends that come in once a week and you know, it's a creative outlet for them as well, because it's not a very strict design since it's redone every week. So people can come in and help. But right before COVID, I hired my first employee,

Bagel: [00:49:50] Wow. Yeah.

Jess: [00:49:52] So I kept her.

Bagel: [00:49:54] Interesting timing. 

Jess:  [00:49:58] Yup. I kept her though you know, it all hit. And I was like, no, I think this is, you know, I really thought long and hard. And so I kept her and now I have five. Yeah. 

Bagel: [00:50:04] Wow, that's great. 

Jess:  [00:50:08] Yeah. It's and they're the best. They're the best people. It's super cool to know that even if I have like very worst case scenario, nobody shows up. Nobody shows up to buy anything, no coffee, no spatulas. I still see at least two of my friends cause they're going to work. So yeah. So it's really, it's really neat.

Bagel: [00:50:26] That's a cool way to look at it too. It's like you could easily be down or depressed about right not having customers. But if you're excited every day, just to do the thing that you're doing. Right. And just to be around the people you want to be around, whether you know them already, or it's a customer, that's your new friend. I could just see how you're creating an environment that, that you're excited about on a daily basis. And I think that's just such a cool lesson for business owners, but also just kind of anyone that's approaching their lives 

Maybe a good question is like how much does mindset factor into, you know, being excited about what you're doing every day. Obviously you've kind of created these businesses. But like how much  of your mindset is at play when you're doing business type things, like having to hire new employees, having to make decisions about evolving and pivoting your business, right? Like how does that factor in.

Jess: [00:51:19] Oh, I think it's to make it or break it. Yeah, I do not like sitting down and looking at the cost of milks. I've got to do it. If I want to see the person who's going to drink the latte. I think mindset is it's so important. And it's also important to allow yourself room to be like, "this stinks. I don't want to do this." But then to decide you're going to do it anyways and to know why you're doing it.  Yeah, I think it's really, really important. And then for those people that don't. You mentioned that not everyone has an Honest Thrift Studio that they can go to. Just to keep looking. There are small businesses tucked in every pocket of the United States. They may not be right down the road from you.

You may have to drive 20 minutes, which isn't that far. Listen to a podcast. And just because you have one bad experience at one small business, don't stop trying. Do not stop trying, that's double negative. But like keep trying, is what I'm trying to say, keep trying to support other small businesses until you find your Honest Thrift Studio. Because as wonderful as Target is, you're never going to get this feeling there. Um, yeah. So you just, you just got to look for them. I have a girlfriend in, Colorado. She's in Colorado. She did, she found a store through Instagram and she's like, Oh, Jess is my Honest Thrift Studio.

And she went and it wasn't, she gave it a second ago. It wasn't, but then she kept going. She found a different store and then it wasn't what she thought. And then on her third small business, she was like, I found it. I found my local small business that I want to like, just support every single day. 

Bagel: [00:52:59] Do you feel inclined to support local? Maybe you already shop at a local craft store, coffee shop or restaurant, contribute to a local charity, organize a neighborhood gathering or sit on your school's PTA. How does this play a role in who you are? If you're not involved locally consider whether this is something that matters to you?

If not, what other ways do you support the communities that you're a part of?

Yeah, it's so cool. And  I think there's probably different things that attract us to any business, but especially small businesses. Cause I feel like a lot of time, there's just a lot of heart in, you know, a small business. Because it's typically the owners of the business are usually, not always, but usually really closely tied to the business operations when it's a small business. And I think there's sort of been a movement. I feel like over the last decade or two, the towards supporting local in lots of different ways. But that's, I think it's, great advice to just kind of keep looking for that, you know, business that you actually want to support and maybe there are different reasons for why you might do that.

Was there anything else you wanted to share either around any other values that were important to you? And or anything else you wanted to touch on in terms of pivoting your business? Cause I know you've kind of talked a little bit about that, but I didn't know if there's anything specific that you wanted to mention.

Jess: [00:54:23] Yes. For pivoting. Since I did choose to run Honest Thrift Studio for the first, almost three years by myself. I just, I just recently thought of this. I have a big box of wildflower seeds in my garage because I have a garden at home that I just love. And if I ever don't know what to put in a spot, or I just need a little bit of filler, I'll just throw a handful of those seeds. It's not a prescription for everyone, but how I've chosen to run both of them is like planting wild flowers. Instead of buying one box of one flower that I know it's going to come up. And those are what the blooms are going to look like. I treat it as if it's going in for wildflower seeds, cause the blooms are unexpected. And that can be not just for forced pivots, but also for just letting other people help you with your business. I've had so many things come to be because of people who walked in and are like, I want to do this. And if I had only planted daisies, I'd be like, no, that's not my bloom. You know, I was doing it by myself. And so I was like, okay, if you want to help, I want you to help. Let's see, you know, let's see what you have. And it has allowed for so much more beauty than if I just did it alone.

Bagel: [00:55:44] Yeah, that's really, really cool. It's a great message. Has there been times where it's been the opposite effect, whereas it's hurt in some way?

Jess: [00:55:56] Oh, all those flowers, don't bloom a hundred percent. But you know, you do it by yourself and you're still gonna have things that fail. You have days where you don't have enough energy to do it all, so then you can't complete it. So then it's not a success. So I just try to view it as that person was, you know, trying to love. And it just was in a way that maybe didn't align so well with my business. But the intentions were good and people are people. We are all, like, I know it sounds cheesy. We are all different kinds of wild flowers. So every time you're going to get one that you just don't really like. You just just have to adapt, but yeah, I've had some bombs for sure.

Bagel: [00:56:42] Yeah. I'm sure. I mean, and every business does. And not to harp on that piece, but I think it's helpful to know that  not everything is going to work out beautifully right. In this like nice analogy of the sunflower, but like, there's also. You know, this potential that can come from allowing someone else to chime in her.  Someone else to give you this input here and get an using the sounding board. And I think for entrepreneurs , and I know I can speak for myself, but a lot of people that I've interacted with that are entrepreneurial are creative. It doesn't even have to be that they've started a business. A lot of creatives tend to really want to hold on to their idea, right? They think their idea is the best idea, and some more easily can take criticism constructively or feedback constructively. And others kind of stave it off and really just kind of hold tight in what they want in their vision. And I've seen good products come from both, but more often than not this allowing others to sort of contribute, to allow something to grow and to blossom kind of going with the flower analogy, right? Like more often than not, we need different sources of energy and to really allow something to bloom. And I think that's just a really cool way of looking at it.

Jess: [00:58:03] Totally. Yeah. It's people are wild.

Bagel: [00:58:08] Yes.

Jess: [00:58:09] People are wild.

Bagel: [00:58:10] I love that. I appreciate your kind of sharing those, those little tidbits and those stories and in ways that you've allowed yourself to evolve over over time. 

Is there anything else maybe from the perspective of a young woman, entrepreneur? Or just someone who is now has sort of run two businesses? Like what are some things that you might share with others in terms of lessons that you've learned  that could potentially help others navigate this.

Cause like, obviously you can't, you know, hyper-speed someone into where you are now, if they're just thinking about starting a business or starting something creative. But like what are maybe some pitfalls to avoid or just some things that you've learned over time that you think can help other people sort of navigate this.

Jess: [00:58:56] To not worry too far into the future. I had so many concerns about my first location that never even came to the surface because I moved. And they just, all that pre worry it was unnecessary. And then I think I almost have reversed advice. I thought, Honest Thrift Studio would only be a year. I had added in my lease a six month break clause in case it really went poorly I would be able to leave. My lease without fees at six months. And then I signed the second year and I was like, maybe, maybe not. It's not going anywhere, which is amazing. And I'm super grateful for it. But I thought I would already be back in corporate sales and I'm really happy I'm not. So.

Maybe for those people that are like starting and are so eager to get to your 10 and your 17 and just all those big moments. Tomorrow's coming. It's why you don't need to worry about it. You don't need to like, get there faster. It's coming at its own speed.

Bagel: [01:00:06] Yeah, that's a great lesson right there. I think it's just so, it's so easy to think big. And in some ways you have to. Right. When you're, when you're planning something and there's something you've been working on for a while, and this sort of seed that's been like planted. Like you're really excited about what it could be. But the worrying about like, okay, what, what's the action I can take today to help it grow tomorrow. Right? Like those things, those micro, yeah. Things are just so, so important to eventually what becomes the longer run that the things you can control. Right? So, so, so many nice analogies here. I love it.

Jess: [01:00:44] And plants are the best when you plant a seed, that thing doesn't do anything above the soil for a long time and you still have to water it. You sill have to get it the right light. You still have to fertilize it. You might even have to give it a companion plant, but then when it comes above the surface, there's no, there's no going back. It never goes back to a seed. Um, yeah.

Bagel: [01:01:09] I was just like, my mind just got blown. Like I think plants are the best analogy for business I've ever covered. That's like, perfect. That is so perfect. I love that.

Jess: [01:01:19] They are. They are it's so, yeah. Plants are the best.

Bagel: [01:01:25] Yeah. Well, I can see why you enjoy that so much.

Jess: [01:01:28] Yeah.

Bagel: [01:01:28] This has been so much fun. Is there anything else that we didn't cover? Is there a next step for Jess? Like, is there anything else that's on the horizon? Or are you just kinda like taking these to day by day and just making the best of what you've got? Obviously COVID is making things challenging right now, but it sounds like you're riding the wave the best you can, which is really cool.

Jess: [01:01:49] Yeah, well, I hope there isn't a third business around the corner for me. But probably, probably not. Isn't a good answer. So.

Bagel: [01:01:59] Because we heard what happened last time. 

Jess: [01:02:00] Yeah, but I think right now that like the big thing for me is just getting a really great food menu. Delicious, affordable, accessible, enjoyable. Something you want to eat all the time. But you don't feel like it's going to break my budget. I can't go to Garden Coffee cause I'll buy all the things. Like, so I'm excited for that. I'm a little nervous for that. I bake the same bake. I don't bake. I cook the same four meals for our house and we probably eat way more takeout than we should. So that's the big thing for me right now.

Bagel: [01:02:36] Yeah, it's hard. It's hard when you're a busy woman running a couple of businesses. I know. It's like you have grand plans about trying to cook your food or, you know, do as best you can. But yeah, sometimes it's just, there's not enough time in the day. It's just the reality of things sometimes.

Jess: [01:02:54] Kraft Mac and cheese is good enough for me.

Bagel: [01:02:57] That's right. Can't go wrong. We brought it full circle from Pogo sticks to Kraft, Mac and cheese all the way back.

Jess: [01:03:04] True and fancy of Jessica.

Bagel: [01:03:07] I love it. I love it. Well, how before we send you off. What are the ways that people can connect with you? Because this has been such a great conversation, obviously for anyone who lives in the San Diego area, but also for any of our listeners who might be going there for a visit. We'd love to find a ways that they can connect with you.

Jess: [01:03:24] Yes. We should all be friends on Instagram. We post on stories for both businesses almost daily, except for Sundays. We rest on Sundays. But Honest Thrift Studio is Honest Thrift Studio. It's a picture of a dog. He's wearing one of those headband Sam bandanas. And then Garden Coffee. Yeah. Also on Instagram is Garden Coffee dot San Diego.

Bagel: [01:03:51] Cool. Awesome. We will make sure we include that in the show notes for people to check it out. I would definitely recommend following both of those accounts.  I've learned a lot and I've been both educated and inspired and probably entertained too. So all three. So you've, you've done a great job. And I'm excited for people to see what you're about. Even if they're, they're not in Southern California, I think for others to just sort of be inspired about, you know, a craft that they're interested in doing or some creative idea that they have.

And of course, for any entrepreneurs that are just looking for some inspiration and  to kind of see how someone is able to be authentic in their social life. Like when I say that, I sort of mean like, in the social platform life, right? Like to show who you are publicly is something that does not come easy to a lot of people.

And I think you'd do really well. So I'll just mention that again, but, yeah. Very great. Cool. Well, I just want to say thank you so much Jess for coming on the show. It's been a lot of fun. I hope you enjoyed it as well. And I can't wait to meet you in person. Hopefully, you know, when things are safe, again we'll come out for a visit. And check out both shops and you know, for sure I will be grabbing a coffee and I'm sure my girlfriend would love to look at some of the plants and all the thrift store items, especially the spatulas.

Jess: [01:05:10] We'll have some acia.

Bagel: [01:05:11] Yes, sounds great. All Right.  If you like, what you heard, please hit subscribe in your podcast app so you get notified about all new episodes of the Live Your Values podcast with me, Bagel. Special thanks to Emma Peck for logo design, Danielle Gelber for marketing strategy,  and Rebecca Kittel and my team at Free Your Time Virtual Assistants for operation support.

 Until next time, get out there and LYV!